"Julie Bove" <jnospambove@bestweb.net> wrote in message
news:vfj8551pg77310@corp.supernews.com...
Thank you very much and keep on truckin'--rb

Julie Bove wrote:

Yes, I am. Shows what *I* know....

Anth <anon@anon.com> wrote in message
news:3efae34f$0$45174$65c69314@mercury.nildram.net ...
The activity of enzymes is dependent, a.o things, on their 3-D structure.
The 3-D structure is, for a very large part, determined by the
physico-chemical surrounding the enzyme. Acids will do several things. One
of the things acids will do is react with certain portions of the enzyme
which will destroy it rendering it inactive. Another effect of acids will be
that the 3-D folding of the protein is changed, also rendering the enzyme
inactive. If that "doesn't cut it" with you, then you should reconsider
going into any of the physical/chemical or medical sciences. This is basic
knowledge.


--

Robert Bronsing

Can't you see?
It all makes perfect sense,
expressed in dollars and cents, pounds, shillings and pence

(R. Waters)

In misc.health.alternative Nico Kadel-Garcia <nkadel@verizon.net> wrote:

: See previous posts. Those enzymes are replacing pancreatic enzymes *in
: the intestines*, not getting out of the digestive system into the
: bloodstream.

Who mentioned enzymes getting out of the digestive system into the
bloodstream?
--
__________
|im |yler http://timtyler.org/ tim@tt1.org

In misc.health.alternative Tsu Dho Nimh <tsudhonimh@lumbercartel.com> wrote:

: The only people who benefit from "digestive enzymes" are those
: with abnormally low HCl production

Consider those who consume dairy and can't make their own Lactase.
--
__________
|im |yler http://timtyler.org/ tim@tt1.org

"Tim Tyler" <tim@tt1.org> schreef in bericht news:HH3Kq0.2wM@bath.ac.uk...
Sage wrote:

"We have had great results in our own healing and that of our clients
using therapeutic enzymes. Starting with 3 caps three times per day,
and increasing the dose when we felt better or "activated", we are now
up to 5 or 6 three times per day.
My wife turned me on to a systemic enzyme formula."

But, he's not the only one who seems to think that enzymes can freely pass
the GI tract into the bloodstream and still do their stuff.....
Did you know it is international kook day today?


--

Robert Bronsing

But that's okay, see the children bleed
It'll look great on the TV

In misc.health.alternative Robert Bronsing <NOSPAMFORbronsing@anat.fgg.eur.nl> wrote:
: "Tim Tyler" <tim@tt1.org> schreef in bericht news:HH3Kq0.2wM@bath.ac.uk...
:> In misc.health.alternative Nico Kadel-Garcia <nkadel@verizon.net> wrote:

:> : See previous posts. Those enzymes are replacing pancreatic enzymes *in
:> : the intestines*, not getting out of the digestive system into the
:> : bloodstream.
:>
:> Who mentioned enzymes getting out of the digestive system into the
:> bloodstream?

: Sage wrote:

: "We have had great results in our own healing and that of our clients
: using therapeutic enzymes. Starting with 3 caps three times per day,
: and increasing the dose when we felt better or "activated", we are now
: up to 5 or 6 three times per day.
: My wife turned me on to a systemic enzyme formula."

No mention of crossing into the blood there. Maybe he's taking lactase ;-)
--
__________
|im |yler http://timtyler.org/ tim@tt1.org

Tim Tyler wrote:

How's it gonna heal anything but the inside of your stomach and
intestine unless it gets to the bloodstream, intact?

On Thu, 26 Jun 2003 23:42:36 GMT, Nico Kadel-Garcia
<nkadel@verizon.net> wrote:

snip..
LOL...easy! If, like pancreatic enzymes, they have their activity in
improving some aspect of digestion, this may improve nutrient
absorption--and hence the range of activities of other bodily
functions. However, if the digestive tract is operating more or less
nominally, I'd want evidence that whatever the intervention was that
it would be worth the cost. Other questions (possibly answered in
previous posts) are WHAT is the intervention, what is the cost and are
there data to support the claims made.

HOWEVER! It does point to the "marketing" aspect of supplements that I
think is at the root of this (pardon the expression).

I am a consumer of supplements. I have used them fairly successfully,
along with other changes in my life, to manage chronic hepatitis C.

I absolutely am CERTAIN that the wide range of "dietary supplements"
and botanical medicines have value--every bit as sure that
pharmaceutical interventions have value. The stupid fucking political
polemic that has some bigots on "either side" slagging the other is
worse than worthless for helping people make treatment decisions.

And the use of advertising by supplement groups AND pharmaceutical
companies--along with egregious examples of corrupt clinical data,
data dredging and spinning, lying about side effects, overblown
pricing and other examples of the sleaze that CAN (and too often does)
happen in any BUSINESS says nothing about the intrinsic risks,
benefits and limitations of any intervention, whether designed to
optimize health/prevent disease or to manage a condition.

The nuances of "enzyme therapy" that have been discussed here,
however, have been mostly interesting and relatively civil, so I
appreciate that.

Two questions--repeating 1: Does anyone have or know where to find
good "maps" of cytokine signalling cascades?

And 2: would you consider glutathione an enzyme? (Not GPx).

thanks for sharing!
George M. Carter

GMCarter wrote:

Unfortunately, it may also summon Tinkerbell from Neverland to spray
Captain Hook with magic dust and make his good arm float away,
extracting him from your duodenum where he's been scraping away and
causing all your medical problems.

It's about as likely as oral encymes having such systemic effects.

Yeah, especially when the advertiser provides not speck of data on the
actual contents of their "enzymes" and their mechanism of effect. The ad
was clearly spam, and the advertiser has clearly proven themselves to be
a multi-level marketer. (Selling the enzyme dealerships is where the
vendor makes their money, not on selling the enzymes themselves, a sure
sign of a Ponzi scheme.)

Excellent questions. I'll look forward to an answer.

On Fri, 27 Jun 2003 23:46:11 GMT, Nico Kadel-Garcia
<nkadel@verizon.net> wrote:

Ah--would you say that orally administered pancreatic have no systemic
effects?

Not that they penetrate themselves systemically but rather that their
activity has distal effects to nutritional status, which is critically
important for sustaining health. From kwashiorkor to Keshan's to HIV
to flu, numerous diseases are exacerbated by impaired nutritional
status.

Mind you--this is a broadened conversation, not supporting or refuting
any claims that initiated this thread.

snip...

THAT doesn't surprise me for a heartbeat. There is plenty of that kind
of horseshit around.

George M. Carter