Can someone explain!

vaccine are miad for trying to boost the imuum system to make anti-bodies
against a virus! so you would be imuum for the virus!

you guessed it already which question i am going to ask!

why make an vaccine if you already have the anti-bodies agaoinst hiv.

hiv-test test you for anti-bodies against hiv! that means you already have
anti-bodies agianst the virus.

so can anyone explain what is the need for a vaccine if the body already
has its anti-bodies agains the virus.

Interesting questions.

First, vaccines are used primarily to PREVENT an infection. So a
vaccine would be given to someone who does NOT have HIV to prevent HIV
infection from occurring. So far, none of the vaccines made to date
achieve this.

Second, there is a newer use for vaccines known as "therapeutic
vaccines." The idea is that the vaccine will stimulate the immune
system to fight HIV in a person who is already infected. The vaccine
would help the body to "see" parts of HIV that do not change (mutate)
so easily.

Antibodies that arise to fight an infection may bind to parts of a
virus or other infecting agent that can mutate. If the body doesn't
produce the right types of antibodies, the virus can "escape"
detection and continue to cause damage to the body. Many infections do
this (despite what Duesberg irrationally claims).

Vaccines also do more than one thing. They can stimulate the body to
make antibodies. They may also stimulate the immune system cells that
see and destroy infected cells (this is called "cell-mediated
immunity"). A good vaccine will stimulate both arms of the immune
system and could help either to prevent a vaccine or possibly act as a
therapeutic in people who are infected.

No such vaccines have been developed yet.

George M. Carter

On Wed, 26 Jan 2005 06:39:55 -0500, "tsip29" <nnormen@hotmail.com>
wrote:

Further to George's reply, there's good evidence that cell-mediated
reponses to HIV are protective (e.g. in the Nairobi prostitute cohort
investigated by Rowland-Jones and McMichael). As with many viruses,
these seem to be the most relevant responses to induce. The trick is
that they seem to wane over time, so as well as inducing them,
presumably some means to making the immunity lasting is required.

I'm vaguely hopeful that something will come up from the research
mentioned above: but early indications are that you may need a
particular immune makeup (HLA alleles and all that). Who knows. Then
there's the issue of which clade(s) to use in the vaccine.
Cheers

Bennett

1. HIV doesn't cause AIDS, so how good is that vaccine going to be?
2. No vaccine has worked yet!
3. It promotes the major death promoting lie that HIV is the cause of AIDS,
while th real cause--drugs, gets ignored



www.whale.to

"tsip29" <nnormen@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:9af579c7e56609aa71860ec2729a4a0a@localhost.ta lkabouthealthnetwork.com...

On Thu, 27 Jan 2005 10:23:15 +0000 (UTC), "john"
<nospamoridiotss@vaccine.con> wrote:

Where is the DEFINITIVE paper PROVING that drugs cause AIDS?

"tsip29" <nnormen@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:9af579c7e56609aa71860ec2729a4a0a@localhost.ta lkabouthealthnetwork.com...
It's all voodoo science, they haven't even proved antibodies are a measure
of immunity! http://www.whale.to/vaccines/antibody.html

On Thu, 27 Jan 2005 19:44:58 +0000 (UTC), "john"
<nospamoridiotss@vaccine.con> wrote:

Oh, crap, you're dumber than a post.

Get an immunology text book and read the thing.

"GMCarter" <fiar@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:01viv0d0dg2leisn4dd95vkt363k96svbq@4ax.com...

Thanks, but I can't digest dogma. If these people you worship had actually
achieved anything then I might be tempted, and even some on your side admit
it is crap.

"Yet Dr March says antibody response is generally a poor measure of
protection and no indicator at all of safety. "Particularly for viral
diseases, the 'cellular' immune response is all important, and antibody
levels and protection are totally unconnected."
http://www.whale.to/v/mmr445.html

I

On Fri, 28 Jan 2005 09:38:22 +0000 (UTC), "john"
<nospamoridiotss@vaccine.con> wrote:

snip
Darling, you can't digest smashed bananas. Your GI tract is filled
with fecal matter that seems to be rapidly replacing neuronal material
as the substance of your being.

Dr. March is just as much of a dumbass as Dr. Duesberg who claims HIV
exists but does not cause AIDS, in part, he claims, because an
antibody-response is generated and therefore all is peachy.

Dr. March is right for many situations--antibody responses may be
inadequate to control an infection in some cases. But CMI may ALSO be
inadequate--or one wouldn't have chronic infections like Hep B, Hep C,
HIV, etc.

Again--get out the immunology text.

You CAN transform those floating turds at least into a bit of
knowledge.

George M. Carter

"GMCarter" <fiar@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:cn3kv0pg09hf455mi72qmmqfsvb18c6q3h@4ax.com...

You claim HIV causes aids and make judgements on my knowledge? LOL

On Fri, 28 Jan 2005 17:09:22 +0000 (UTC), "john"
<nospamoridiotss@vaccine.con> wrote:

LOL. I certainly do!

"GMCarter" <fiar@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:qddlv0pmiu39aah567pplvl2q1kmk5enct@4ax.com...

Yeah, well, we all know about your covert-hostile tendancies, just a pity
you have to infect the innocent with your pharma shill lies

On Sat, 29 Jan 2005 10:55:15 +0000 (UTC), "john"
<nospamoridiotss@vaccine.con> wrote:

Ah, the usual litany of personal attacks! Hey--fuck you too!

What covert? I think when I'm being hostile it's pretty obvioius.

And I think it's obvious that I'm no fan of pharma. Research? Science?
You bet. And there are some good ones in the pharma industry. The
SYSTEM, tho, of profiteering on patents, is a ghastly lie.

Of course, what YOU do with your bullshit whale sites is
1) mislead some few people who read that detritus into thinking HIV is
harmless, which is just evil; and

2) provide a wonderful opportunity for the "anti-alternative" bigots
to point to your site and say "see? they're all fucking morons who
haven't the brains god gave a gnat."

Well, in your case, they'd be correct. But it allows for the continued
dismissal of alternatives.

For me, I'm interested in what works. That can be found on "both
sides" of this arbitrary divide.

So congrats, john, you're a double asshole for spreading ignorance as
well as potentially augmenting, in your own small way, one of the
worst pandemics in human history!

A fine example of why your mother should have had an abortion!!

So: how's that for overt hostility?

George M. Carter

"GMCarter" <fiar@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:tlgpv05eu7tjhjfg8f14ha6i7o74equhbl@4ax.com...

There is no doubt about that, it's the covert type you are clueless about,
which Lauritsen points out in AIDS Death Cult, and you can see by adopting a
covert-death wish creed in pharma propaganda, eg HIV, vaccines and pharma
creed drugs like anti virals. And Mackow points out
http://www.savethemales.ca/201101.html

You can't see it, obviously.

On Sun, 30 Jan 2005 11:40:26 +0000 (UTC), "john"
<nospamoridiotss@vaccine.con> wrote:

I see. "Fuck you" is considered "covert" in your queer lexicon...

I can see a page full of the most idiotic, self-hating, homophobic
tripe I've seen in ages! LOL. This Henry Makow sounds like your
typical fag basher. John Lauritsen, as well, is not much of a resource
either, for that matter.

Indeed, there are human foibles. All humans experience them. They take
on "local" flavors depending on issues of ethnicity, socioeconomic
status, gender, age, orientation....big deal. Humans are a mixed lot.
This screed sounds like it was a homework assignment from, Himmler
High.

And that's what makes you such a fucking idiot, John, that this is the
kind of vile codswallop YOU buy and spread around!

There! Nice and overt for ya?

George M. Carter

"GMCarter" <fiar@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:51nqv01qkqmpgc4rgtd361gjr75c9ss5mk@4ax.com...

No, that's overt. Embracing a death creed like HIV and pharma drugs is a
"covert" way to kill yourself off, or worse still, others, as who cares
about you, you don't obviously. Let's face it, if I was as full of hate as
you, I'd be looking to end it, ASAP. There are many covert suicide ploys,
and HIV+ is one of them. Real coverts like to take out as many as possible
when they go, so you like to spread the lies, and attack the truth. Look up
the tone scale.

On Sun, 30 Jan 2005 22:37:22 +0000 (UTC), "john"
<nospamoridiotss@vaccine.con> wrote:

To the contrary. Being in denial is a sure way to death. Ask David
Pasquarelli. He believed your denialist nonsense and he died of AIDS.

Huh?

I think you paint a portrait of yourself with this!

The reality is we are ALL mortal.

What I reject is your views of the world which are demonstrably wrong
for the most part. Whether you want to believe it or not, there is an
objective, measurable reality out there. HIV is part of that. AIDS is
part of that.

Attitudes TOWARD the disease--as with any disease--can have some
impact on outcome.

But simply singing "LALALALALALALA--I CAN'T HEAR YOU!!!" at the top of
your lungs won't change the fact HIV exists and causes AIDS. Any more
than it will change the reality of cancer, infectious diseases or
tsunamis.

George M. Carter

"GMCarter" <fiar@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:rt6sv0dldd3vhvc1iturag7edjehl9sr0r@4ax.com...

Just another hoax, if you look at the bigger medical picture it is a bit
obvious they can't be trusted http://www.whale.to/a/hoaxmed.html

Buy a story off proven liars, and the leading killers, and disease makers on
the planet?

You are either a pharma brainwashed moron, a pharma shill, or a
covert-hostile mayhem purveyor--in your case probably all 3.

On Mon, 31 Jan 2005 13:07:49 +0000 (UTC), "john"
<nospamoridiotss@vaccine.con> wrote:

Nonsense. HIV is not a hoax and just because a system has serious
problems doesn't render all its findings false. If that were so, no
findings would be valid under any system because they ALL have flaws
and are ALL prone to corruption.

With HIV, the study of the virus has been undertaken in many
countries, many disciplines, thousands of researchers. Some of them
are liars or frauds or simply profiteers. But not all of them. Nor are
the many, many friends I've lost over the years to AIDS. All over this
planet.

I see you are doing well with your overt hostility lessons! Bravo.

However, I'm none of the above.

George M. Carter

"GMCarter" <fiar@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:bbftv0dpev49cjvv62o5sk65qe6m9kf898@4ax.com...

I don't have much time for pharma shills, killers in sheeps clothing

If you act like one expect to be treated like one, as the saying goes--if
you walk like a duck, quack like a duck etc